First, I want to say that Cata and I planned everything out well in advance. We talked about every single blow, we discussed outcomes, we also considered Ginia's level in comparison with specifically Kakashi, and then specifically the people within Kakashi's world because Kakashi would absolutely compare her since that's the way he's been trained.
Going into my response, I must say I am a little confused as your language suggests you are familiar with Naruto, and specifically with Kakashi. But canon facts overwhelmingly contradict the majority of the points you've made here. One of the very first things that ever happens in canon is a demonstration that not even Sasuke could land a single hit on him, and Sasuke as a 12 year old was able to perform a Katon Goukyakku no Jutsu fireball technique, which is an A-rank technique. If you watch Kakashi's fight with two S-Rank Akatsuki members simultaneously, Hidan and Kakuzu, you will note that at no point is Hidan capable of even scratching Kakashi even ONCE with his blade. I might also note at the same time that Kakashi was fighting Hidan, he was also fighting 3 of Kakuzu's S-rank heart monsters simultaneously which included lightning, wind, and fire massive S-rank attacks, none which managed to successfully fuck him up enough to give Hidan an opening. That's one Kakashi vs 6 S-rank shinobi with insane powers. Sure, he had the help of Ino-Shika-Chou, but if you watch the fight over here, you will see that Kakashi overwhelmingly fights alone for big portions of it.
You may also want to refer to Naruto and Sakura's post-timeskip bell test where neither one of them were capable of landing a single hit until they pulled the Icha Icha thing at the end, especially Sakura, who at this point, is not only a chuunin, but able to crack the ground open with one hit. (Seeing as Naruto in particular attempted to launch something like 4-5 different clones at Kakashi simultaneously and still wasn't able to get him, that's a pretty big thing to notice.) It's also important to note that Kakashi has 27 years of experience and Ginia has less than 15. Of those 27 years of experience, 14 of which were Kakashi serving in the capacity of a jounin, which is the most elite rank of ninja in Naruto. He's also served in at least two wars canonically on front lines, so her experience doesn't come close to his own. I might also note that Kakashi is canonically considered Hokage level and was in fact a candidate for Hokage for a brief period of time when Tsunade was out of commission.
Some Data Book Stats of missions Kakashi has taken as of the beginning of Shippuden:
197 missions D 190 missions C 414 missions B 298 missions A (Zabuza-level) 42 missions S (Akatsuki-level)
In terms of his assessment that Ginia is like a genin, you may want to consider her actual skills against someone like Sasuke or Neji during pre-timeskip, both of whom were very good at what they did, but nevertheless, still genin. The same thing actually goes for genin Rock Lee. (It should also be of important note that Naruto himself took down a chuunin alone with just taijutsu.)
While I understand that you may be bothered by the "elitism" in Kakashi's thinking, can I ask if you have any canon evidence that would suggest Kakashi himself would think anything else? Not only did she charge at him directly (he canonically thinks to himself that Naruto and Sakura were "naive" to come at him head-first) each time when she tried to spar with him hand-to-hand, but she also didn't do anything that would potentially give her leverage to distract him for even a moment. Those were his assessments of her, and that is also why he believed she could stand to be trained by someone who is very skilled.
As for the age thing: Kakashi doesn't really care about that. He was 5 years old when he graduated from Academy, 6 years old when he became a chuunin, 13 years old when he became a jounin, and 14 years old when he joined ANBU. Which means, his entire life he's had to work with people much older than him, possibly train next to or alongside them. Canonically, during the Zabuza arc, he stated that there are some children who can be younger than Naruto but even more powerful than himself. This is a clear canon acknowledgment that he understands age does not indicate level of ability or power.
In terms of Kakashi adapting to firearms, Kirk gave him a demonstration and instruction in firearms (we did not play it out, it was handwaved but then there were mentions of it over the months I've played Kakashi here and there, and we also discussed it several times). Canon evidence does suggest that Kakashi or ninjas in particular are capable of using kawarimi no jutsu at point-blank range or within a milliseconds. To go back to the fight with Hidan and Kakuzu, there was a moment when Hidan did in fact catch up with Kakashi and carved him up. For a moment, it looks like Kakashi actually lost because not only did he just lie there for a moment, but Hidan was right on top of him. But then, he poofs into a log and it turned out that Hidan had sliced a log. During his fight with Pain, he faced off against one of Pain's crazy paths, which actually had a freaking rocket launcher. Kakashi actually zapped away that rocket with some dumb eye hacks and then rather unspectacularly died.
So, to sum up the above: canon not only overwhelmingly supports and addresses every point of criticism you made regarding the fight, but if you were to actually sit down and rewatch some of these fights as I did while I was actually playing this thread out with Cata, you'll notice that I've actually dialed him down, not up. If you'd like specific examples of how I've dialed him down in comparison to canon, I would be happy to provide those.
Regarding the way he is written:
When I write Kakashi, I do so through free indirect discourse, which means at least 99% of the time, what I write, whether that be prose or brackets or dialogue, is only from his perspective; the narrator is Kakashi, not me. I only insert myself very rarely as a narrator during moments when it's very obviously me stating something, but the writing and tone and everything changes when I do that, and is usually in strikeout.
I am very sorry, but I cannot dial back how he thinks about his world or techniques, because to do so would compromise the very nature of the character and frankly, in my opinion, make him OOC. You're talking about a dude who's been doing this for 27 years of his life. It's all he knows, it's all he lives for. He literally has nothing outside of being a ninja. He is not shown capable of having a life outside of being a ninja at any point in the entire series, other than the rare moments when he's reading porn. He has no reason to not think the things he thinks, specifically everything he is thinking here.
Not everyone roleplays the same; many people, when they write narration, position themselves as narrators in brackets or prose. I am not, and never will be that kind of a roleplayer or writer. My character will always be the narrator, and as such, my characters thoughts/feelings/beliefs will bleed into the writing. That being said, I hope you understand that I certainly do not believe the things Kakashi believes. I also do not think that Naruto is the most "elite" canon in the game, but then, neither does Kakashi. (DBZ would outdo them overwhelmingly, and so would quite a number of other canons in the game.)
Of course, I want to make the alliance plot as fun as possible for everyone, but I can't do so at the expense of making my own character OOC. I hope you can understand how I feel. If you have suggestions as to how I can address these issues without sacrificing characterization, I would really appreciate that.
Also, I would just like to add that if the "some others" to whom you refer have any suggestions or criticism, they are more than welcome to approach me here or privately via my own HMD. If anon-commenting is more comfortable for anyone, I am fine with that as well.
no subject
First, I want to say that Cata and I planned everything out well in advance. We talked about every single blow, we discussed outcomes, we also considered Ginia's level in comparison with specifically Kakashi, and then specifically the people within Kakashi's world because Kakashi would absolutely compare her since that's the way he's been trained.
Going into my response, I must say I am a little confused as your language suggests you are familiar with Naruto, and specifically with Kakashi. But canon facts overwhelmingly contradict the majority of the points you've made here. One of the very first things that ever happens in canon is a demonstration that not even Sasuke could land a single hit on him, and Sasuke as a 12 year old was able to perform a Katon Goukyakku no Jutsu fireball technique, which is an A-rank technique. If you watch Kakashi's fight with two S-Rank Akatsuki members simultaneously, Hidan and Kakuzu, you will note that at no point is Hidan capable of even scratching Kakashi even ONCE with his blade. I might also note at the same time that Kakashi was fighting Hidan, he was also fighting 3 of Kakuzu's S-rank heart monsters simultaneously which included lightning, wind, and fire massive S-rank attacks, none which managed to successfully fuck him up enough to give Hidan an opening. That's one Kakashi vs 6 S-rank shinobi with insane powers. Sure, he had the help of Ino-Shika-Chou, but if you watch the fight over here, you will see that Kakashi overwhelmingly fights alone for big portions of it.
You may also want to refer to Naruto and Sakura's post-timeskip bell test where neither one of them were capable of landing a single hit until they pulled the Icha Icha thing at the end, especially Sakura, who at this point, is not only a chuunin, but able to crack the ground open with one hit. (Seeing as Naruto in particular attempted to launch something like 4-5 different clones at Kakashi simultaneously and still wasn't able to get him, that's a pretty big thing to notice.) It's also important to note that Kakashi has 27 years of experience and Ginia has less than 15. Of those 27 years of experience, 14 of which were Kakashi serving in the capacity of a jounin, which is the most elite rank of ninja in Naruto. He's also served in at least two wars canonically on front lines, so her experience doesn't come close to his own. I might also note that Kakashi is canonically considered Hokage level and was in fact a candidate for Hokage for a brief period of time when Tsunade was out of commission.
Some Data Book Stats of missions Kakashi has taken as of the beginning of Shippuden:
197 missions D
190 missions C
414 missions B
298 missions A (Zabuza-level)
42 missions S (Akatsuki-level)
In terms of his assessment that Ginia is like a genin, you may want to consider her actual skills against someone like Sasuke or Neji during pre-timeskip, both of whom were very good at what they did, but nevertheless, still genin. The same thing actually goes for genin Rock Lee. (It should also be of important note that Naruto himself took down a chuunin alone with just taijutsu.)
While I understand that you may be bothered by the "elitism" in Kakashi's thinking, can I ask if you have any canon evidence that would suggest Kakashi himself would think anything else? Not only did she charge at him directly (he canonically thinks to himself that Naruto and Sakura were "naive" to come at him head-first) each time when she tried to spar with him hand-to-hand, but she also didn't do anything that would potentially give her leverage to distract him for even a moment. Those were his assessments of her, and that is also why he believed she could stand to be trained by someone who is very skilled.
As for the age thing: Kakashi doesn't really care about that. He was 5 years old when he graduated from Academy, 6 years old when he became a chuunin, 13 years old when he became a jounin, and 14 years old when he joined ANBU. Which means, his entire life he's had to work with people much older than him, possibly train next to or alongside them. Canonically, during the Zabuza arc, he stated that there are some children who can be younger than Naruto but even more powerful than himself. This is a clear canon acknowledgment that he understands age does not indicate level of ability or power.
In terms of Kakashi adapting to firearms, Kirk gave him a demonstration and instruction in firearms (we did not play it out, it was handwaved but then there were mentions of it over the months I've played Kakashi here and there, and we also discussed it several times). Canon evidence does suggest that Kakashi or ninjas in particular are capable of using kawarimi no jutsu at point-blank range or within a milliseconds. To go back to the fight with Hidan and Kakuzu, there was a moment when Hidan did in fact catch up with Kakashi and carved him up. For a moment, it looks like Kakashi actually lost because not only did he just lie there for a moment, but Hidan was right on top of him. But then, he poofs into a log and it turned out that Hidan had sliced a log. During his fight with Pain, he faced off against one of Pain's crazy paths, which actually had a freaking rocket launcher. Kakashi actually zapped away that rocket with some dumb eye hacks and then rather unspectacularly died.
So, to sum up the above: canon not only overwhelmingly supports and addresses every point of criticism you made regarding the fight, but if you were to actually sit down and rewatch some of these fights as I did while I was actually playing this thread out with Cata, you'll notice that I've actually dialed him down, not up. If you'd like specific examples of how I've dialed him down in comparison to canon, I would be happy to provide those.
Regarding the way he is written:
When I write Kakashi, I do so through free indirect discourse, which means at least 99% of the time, what I write, whether that be prose or brackets or dialogue, is only from his perspective; the narrator is Kakashi, not me. I only insert myself very rarely as a narrator during moments when it's very obviously me stating something, but the writing and tone and everything changes when I do that, and is usually in
strikeout.I am very sorry, but I cannot dial back how he thinks about his world or techniques, because to do so would compromise the very nature of the character and frankly, in my opinion, make him OOC. You're talking about a dude who's been doing this for 27 years of his life. It's all he knows, it's all he lives for. He literally has nothing outside of being a ninja. He is not shown capable of having a life outside of being a ninja at any point in the entire series, other than the rare moments when he's reading porn. He has no reason to not think the things he thinks, specifically everything he is thinking here.
Not everyone roleplays the same; many people, when they write narration, position themselves as narrators in brackets or prose. I am not, and never will be that kind of a roleplayer or writer. My character will always be the narrator, and as such, my characters thoughts/feelings/beliefs will bleed into the writing. That being said, I hope you understand that I certainly do not believe the things Kakashi believes. I also do not think that Naruto is the most "elite" canon in the game, but then, neither does Kakashi. (DBZ would outdo them overwhelmingly, and so would quite a number of other canons in the game.)
Of course, I want to make the alliance plot as fun as possible for everyone, but I can't do so at the expense of making my own character OOC. I hope you can understand how I feel. If you have suggestions as to how I can address these issues without sacrificing characterization, I would really appreciate that.
Also, I would just like to add that if the "some others" to whom you refer have any suggestions or criticism, they are more than welcome to approach me here or privately via my own HMD. If anon-commenting is more comfortable for anyone, I am fine with that as well.